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	<title>Comments on: Analyzing Iran 2009: Part 1, Pre-election polls</title>
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	<link>http://election.princeton.edu/2009/06/18/analyzing-iran-2009-part-1-pre-election-polls/</link>
	<description>A first draft of electoral history</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Thu, 12 Nov 2009 02:35:25 -0500</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Transatlantikblog T.A.B. &#187; Iran: Lügen so dick wie Schlangen</title>
		<link>http://election.princeton.edu/2009/06/18/analyzing-iran-2009-part-1-pre-election-polls/comment-page-1/#comment-3172</link>
		<dc:creator>Transatlantikblog T.A.B. &#187; Iran: Lügen so dick wie Schlangen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 21 Jun 2009 16:36:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://election.princeton.edu/?p=3095#comment-3172</guid>
		<description>[...] vorherige Umfrage finden.  Zum anderen gibt es eine interessante Untersuchung der Princeton Universität just zu diesen Umfragen, die gehörige Zweifel anmelden. Perthes indessen hat sie 1:1 für seine [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] vorherige Umfrage finden.  Zum anderen gibt es eine interessante Untersuchung der Princeton Universität just zu diesen Umfragen, die gehörige Zweifel anmelden. Perthes indessen hat sie 1:1 für seine [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Iran&#8217;s election protestors will not&#8230;. Analyzing Iran 2009:&#8230;. &#124; Total Info</title>
		<link>http://election.princeton.edu/2009/06/18/analyzing-iran-2009-part-1-pre-election-polls/comment-page-1/#comment-3169</link>
		<dc:creator>Iran&#8217;s election protestors will not&#8230;. Analyzing Iran 2009:&#8230;. &#124; Total Info</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 Jun 2009 16:40:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://election.princeton.edu/?p=3095#comment-3169</guid>
		<description>[...] The Iranian election presents a harder case. Polling is sparse, professional standards of reporting polls are absent, and respondents are potentiallRead more at http://election.princeton.edu/2009/06/18/analyzing-iran-2009-part-1-pre-election-polls/ [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] The Iranian election presents a harder case. Polling is sparse, professional standards of reporting polls are absent, and respondents are potentiallRead more at <a href="http://election.princeton.edu/2009/06/18/analyzing-iran-2009-part-1-pre-election-polls/" rel="nofollow">http://election.princeton.edu/2009/06/18/analyzing-iran-2009-part-1-pre-election-polls/</a> [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Mohammad</title>
		<link>http://election.princeton.edu/2009/06/18/analyzing-iran-2009-part-1-pre-election-polls/comment-page-1/#comment-3168</link>
		<dc:creator>Mohammad</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 Jun 2009 08:21:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://election.princeton.edu/?p=3095#comment-3168</guid>
		<description>Firstly, we should notice that in 1.5 - 3.5m protest of Azadi st, people were really afraid of being arrested or killed. The police - two hours before the protest - came to TV and asked everyone stay in their home! Hence, 1.5m people proves that mousavi had much more vote in Tehran (he claimed 4m which is rational I think!)

On the other hand, two years ago, people were not satisfied with reformers (Khatami was the president those years and people were angry about some of his actions) Hence, when Hashemi Rafsanjani (a reformist)  was against Ahmadinejaad, people did not tend to vote, and another important fact is that Hashemi was not popular in Iran and a lot of people vote for Ahmadinejaad because they hated Hashemi!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Firstly, we should notice that in 1.5 &#8211; 3.5m protest of Azadi st, people were really afraid of being arrested or killed. The police &#8211; two hours before the protest &#8211; came to TV and asked everyone stay in their home! Hence, 1.5m people proves that mousavi had much more vote in Tehran (he claimed 4m which is rational I think!)</p>
<p>On the other hand, two years ago, people were not satisfied with reformers (Khatami was the president those years and people were angry about some of his actions) Hence, when Hashemi Rafsanjani (a reformist)  was against Ahmadinejaad, people did not tend to vote, and another important fact is that Hashemi was not popular in Iran and a lot of people vote for Ahmadinejaad because they hated Hashemi!</p>
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		<title>By: Analyzing Iran 2009:&#8230;. GenevaLunch &#187; Blog Archive&#8230;. &#124; Popular over Internet</title>
		<link>http://election.princeton.edu/2009/06/18/analyzing-iran-2009-part-1-pre-election-polls/comment-page-1/#comment-3166</link>
		<dc:creator>Analyzing Iran 2009:&#8230;. GenevaLunch &#187; Blog Archive&#8230;. &#124; Popular over Internet</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 19 Jun 2009 15:41:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://election.princeton.edu/?p=3095#comment-3166</guid>
		<description>[...] Three general categories of data are currently available for validating the Iranian election: (1) pre-election polls, (2) statistical methods for analyzing standalone voting data, and (3) statistical comparisons with past elections. Categories (2) and (3) are out on the web already, and I&#8217;ll comment Read more at http://election.princeton.edu/2009/06/18/analyzing-iran-2009-part-1-pre-election-polls/ [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Three general categories of data are currently available for validating the Iranian election: (1) pre-election polls, (2) statistical methods for analyzing standalone voting data, and (3) statistical comparisons with past elections. Categories (2) and (3) are out on the web already, and I&#8217;ll comment Read more at <a href="http://election.princeton.edu/2009/06/18/analyzing-iran-2009-part-1-pre-election-polls/" rel="nofollow">http://election.princeton.edu/2009/06/18/analyzing-iran-2009-part-1-pre-election-polls/</a> [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Shirin Ebadi: Void the Elections&#8230;. Analyzing Iran 2009,&#8230;. &#124; Popular over Internet</title>
		<link>http://election.princeton.edu/2009/06/18/analyzing-iran-2009-part-1-pre-election-polls/comment-page-1/#comment-3165</link>
		<dc:creator>Shirin Ebadi: Void the Elections&#8230;. Analyzing Iran 2009,&#8230;. &#124; Popular over Internet</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 19 Jun 2009 14:40:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://election.princeton.edu/?p=3095#comment-3165</guid>
		<description>[...] Three general categories of data are currently available for validating the Iranian election: (1) pre-election polls, (2) statistical methods for analyzing standalone voting data, and (3) statistical comparisons with past elections. Categories (2) and (3) are out on the web already, and I&#8217;ll comment Read more at http://election.princeton.edu/2009/06/18/analyzing-iran-2009-part-1-pre-election-polls/ [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Three general categories of data are currently available for validating the Iranian election: (1) pre-election polls, (2) statistical methods for analyzing standalone voting data, and (3) statistical comparisons with past elections. Categories (2) and (3) are out on the web already, and I&#8217;ll comment Read more at <a href="http://election.princeton.edu/2009/06/18/analyzing-iran-2009-part-1-pre-election-polls/" rel="nofollow">http://election.princeton.edu/2009/06/18/analyzing-iran-2009-part-1-pre-election-polls/</a> [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Sam Wang</title>
		<link>http://election.princeton.edu/2009/06/18/analyzing-iran-2009-part-1-pre-election-polls/comment-page-1/#comment-3163</link>
		<dc:creator>Sam Wang</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 19 Jun 2009 13:20:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://election.princeton.edu/?p=3095#comment-3163</guid>
		<description>&lt;b&gt;David,&lt;/b&gt; follow the link to find a formula, SD_estimated = (median absolute deviation)*1.483. After that I believe  SEM can be calculated in the usual way. In this case the n=3 confidence interval is large because of the one outlier showing Ahmadinejad ahead.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><b>David,</b> follow the link to find a formula, SD_estimated = (median absolute deviation)*1.483. After that I believe  SEM can be calculated in the usual way. In this case the n=3 confidence interval is large because of the one outlier showing Ahmadinejad ahead.</p>
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		<title>By: Sam Wang</title>
		<link>http://election.princeton.edu/2009/06/18/analyzing-iran-2009-part-1-pre-election-polls/comment-page-1/#comment-3162</link>
		<dc:creator>Sam Wang</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 19 Jun 2009 12:27:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://election.princeton.edu/?p=3095#comment-3162</guid>
		<description>&lt;b&gt;Mohammad&lt;/b&gt; (3:41 am), that&#039;s an interesting point. But to be honest, I don&#039;t necessarily think your observation proves the point. One problem is that a crowd that large is extremely hard to estimate. If Tehran was approximately split between Ahmadinejad and Moussavi, Moussavi supporters would feel numerous - and therefore suspect fraud. However, I agree in general that the protests will end up telling a story that these polls do not.

&lt;b&gt;Mohammad&lt;/b&gt; (4:05 am), That appears to be a good survey; its numbers for issues such as nuclear weapons and Hamas/Hezbollah are illuminating for U.S. readers. Its bar graphs have errors so they should be ignored.

But for our purposes here there is a problem. It reports many undecided voters in the presidential race. In US polling, undecideds tend to vote against the incumbent (Ahmadinejad in this case). Combined with the survey it would suggest a fairly close race. But this is not guaranteed.

In regard to turnout, I note that only about 21m voted in 2005. What was the general feeling that year?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><b>Mohammad</b> (3:41 am), that&#8217;s an interesting point. But to be honest, I don&#8217;t necessarily think your observation proves the point. One problem is that a crowd that large is extremely hard to estimate. If Tehran was approximately split between Ahmadinejad and Moussavi, Moussavi supporters would feel numerous &#8211; and therefore suspect fraud. However, I agree in general that the protests will end up telling a story that these polls do not.</p>
<p><b>Mohammad</b> (4:05 am), That appears to be a good survey; its numbers for issues such as nuclear weapons and Hamas/Hezbollah are illuminating for U.S. readers. Its bar graphs have errors so they should be ignored.</p>
<p>But for our purposes here there is a problem. It reports many undecided voters in the presidential race. In US polling, undecideds tend to vote against the incumbent (Ahmadinejad in this case). Combined with the survey it would suggest a fairly close race. But this is not guaranteed.</p>
<p>In regard to turnout, I note that only about 21m voted in 2005. What was the general feeling that year?</p>
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		<title>By: Mohammad</title>
		<link>http://election.princeton.edu/2009/06/18/analyzing-iran-2009-part-1-pre-election-polls/comment-page-1/#comment-3160</link>
		<dc:creator>Mohammad</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 19 Jun 2009 08:05:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://election.princeton.edu/?p=3095#comment-3160</guid>
		<description>I should also include two points.
Firstly, would you please tell me your idea about this pre election polling? 

http://www.terrorfreetomorrow.org/upimagestft/TFT%20Iran%20Survey%20Report%200609.pdf

secondly, it&#039;s very important to notice that most polling expect 28m to 35m of people to vote in recent election. However, around 40m vote in this election which, in my viewpoint, was a strong reason why people vote for mousavi (It&#039;s clear that when we want a reformer, we vote more). I cannot believe that 26 percent more than 2005 election vote, because they want Ahmadinejaad.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I should also include two points.<br />
Firstly, would you please tell me your idea about this pre election polling? </p>
<p><a href="http://www.terrorfreetomorrow.org/upimagestft/TFT%20Iran%20Survey%20Report%200609.pdf" rel="nofollow">http://www.terrorfreetomorrow.org/upimagestft/TFT%20Iran%20Survey%20Report%200609.pdf</a></p>
<p>secondly, it&#8217;s very important to notice that most polling expect 28m to 35m of people to vote in recent election. However, around 40m vote in this election which, in my viewpoint, was a strong reason why people vote for mousavi (It&#8217;s clear that when we want a reformer, we vote more). I cannot believe that 26 percent more than 2005 election vote, because they want Ahmadinejaad.</p>
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		<title>By: Mohammad</title>
		<link>http://election.princeton.edu/2009/06/18/analyzing-iran-2009-part-1-pre-election-polls/comment-page-1/#comment-3158</link>
		<dc:creator>Mohammad</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 19 Jun 2009 07:41:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://election.princeton.edu/?p=3095#comment-3158</guid>
		<description>Thanks very much for your note. Of course I&#039;m not a student of Statisitcs, but I want to mention another point which shows why official results in Tehran are unbelievable. In Tehran Monday&#039;s protest, there were at least 1,500,000 people in streets. (Various agencies estimated the population between 1.5m to 3.5m). I should mention that many people did not come to Azadi st. because they were afraid of police and the MOI emphasized that we are not permitted to come to streets. On the other hand, the announced that Mousavi has 2,100,000 votes in Tehran. It&#039;s really funny! When at least 1.5m people came to streets, there is no doubt that he had much more than 2.1m votes. Don&#039;t forget that they killed 8 people in Azadi because they did not want to see these huge population again.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks very much for your note. Of course I&#8217;m not a student of Statisitcs, but I want to mention another point which shows why official results in Tehran are unbelievable. In Tehran Monday&#8217;s protest, there were at least 1,500,000 people in streets. (Various agencies estimated the population between 1.5m to 3.5m). I should mention that many people did not come to Azadi st. because they were afraid of police and the MOI emphasized that we are not permitted to come to streets. On the other hand, the announced that Mousavi has 2,100,000 votes in Tehran. It&#8217;s really funny! When at least 1.5m people came to streets, there is no doubt that he had much more than 2.1m votes. Don&#8217;t forget that they killed 8 people in Azadi because they did not want to see these huge population again.</p>
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		<title>By: David Shor</title>
		<link>http://election.princeton.edu/2009/06/18/analyzing-iran-2009-part-1-pre-election-polls/comment-page-1/#comment-3157</link>
		<dc:creator>David Shor</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 19 Jun 2009 06:49:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://election.princeton.edu/?p=3095#comment-3157</guid>
		<description>Not to spam, but I&#039;ve posted some commentary on this post at http://stochasticdemocracy.blogspot.com/2009/06/more-iran-coverage.html .

If I can ask a dumber statistical question, how would one construct confidence intervals using MAD-SEM assuming normally distributed data?

I&#039;d assume that a 95% confidence interval would be 1.96*σ~1.96*(1.48*MAD), but it&#039;s early in this time zone, and the intervals seem too wide to pass a sanity test.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Not to spam, but I&#8217;ve posted some commentary on this post at <a href="http://stochasticdemocracy.blogspot.com/2009/06/more-iran-coverage.html" rel="nofollow">http://stochasticdemocracy.blogspot.com/2009/06/more-iran-coverage.html</a> .</p>
<p>If I can ask a dumber statistical question, how would one construct confidence intervals using MAD-SEM assuming normally distributed data?</p>
<p>I&#8217;d assume that a 95% confidence interval would be 1.96*σ~1.96*(1.48*MAD), but it&#8217;s early in this time zone, and the intervals seem too wide to pass a sanity test.</p>
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